Passing The Torch #08: Solving Real Problems, with Jed and Sophia Lazar

Marcos Bravo: Hello, everyone, and welcome to a very special episode of passing the torch. This is episode number eight. My name is Marcos and this is the podcast by GrowthMentor. Why is it a special episode? Because this is the last episode I’m recording in my studio, this beautiful studio, I’ve seen many, many videos being recorded. And the reason is because I’m moving to a different country. So I cannot take the studio with me. I will let you know more about what am I doing. But today the focus is on my two incredible guests, which are Jed and Sophia, the founders of Cozy Juicy Real. I know that doesn’t make much sense right now to you. But it will make sense throughout the podcast. So learn how these guys, build this amazing product that is going to blow your mind, especially when you’re in HR. And with that being said, I just want to invite you to subscribe to our podcast to follow our social media channels, and to stick around for the following conversation.

Marcos Bravo: Okay, well, hello, guys, nice to have you in the last official episode in my studio. So it’s great to finish this half-season with you guys. It’s amazing. And I’m gonna let everybody know what you guys are doing, and how we met and all of those things. But first of all, welcome to the show, guys.

Jed Lazar: Thank you.

Sophia Lazar: Good to be here. And it’s good to see you again. Well, I know right?

Marcos Bravo: It’s been a while it’s been a while. So before we get into the cozy juicy real, which for now doesn’t make sense to you guys watching. But it will make a lot of sense for him to tell us the story of how this started. And where’s it going? But I was it because it’s the growth mentor podcast, I want to touch this bit first and get it out of the way. What’s the relationship that you guys had with the growth mentor? How and how did you use that help in the stuff that you’re developing that we’re going to cover in a second? So how did it start?

Jed Lazar: Sophia, you found out about growth mentor, didn’t you?

Sophia Lazar: I did. And I actually don’t remember how exactly.

Marcos Bravo: It’s one of the things word of mouth?

Sophia Lazar: Yeah, I don’t I don’t I honestly don’t remember if I searched and found something or what. But as soon as I found it, I was like, we have to do this. We were just dying out we were an early company. So it’s just Jed and me. It was just me now we’ve got a couple of people that work with us. But at the time, it was kind of like we needed outside support. Like we need people that know.

Marcos Bravo: Oh, absolutely. Don’t worry.

Sophia Lazar: We kind of signed up for a year. And ever since we’ve been using it. I think we’ve been members for what, three years now?

Jed Lazar: It’s been a long time. I was just looking at it on the platform. We’ve done 36 sessions.

Marcos Bravo: Oh, wow. Yeah.

Sophia Lazar: And I think more like just ad hoc, kind of, like repeat with people who have been up for kind of just catching up like touching base, say, a week later, two weeks later or whatever.

Marcos Bravo: A little checkup?

Sophia Lazar: Yeah, exactly. So I mean, it’s been amazing.

Marcos Bravo: What was the first problem that you guys got? I mean, what was the first thing that pushed it? Like, we need the extra help? Was it just the branding, just just to make sure the idea was good? What was the first thing you said like, Right, we need we put an extra voice into this.

Jed Lazar: The first few sessions were about customers and customer journey, like understanding because you know, you’re setting up a new business, you don’t understand who your customer is, you don’t understand how they’re finding out about you or what their experience is like. And, you know, I’ve run a business before but every business is completely different. And it wasn’t until we started using growth mentor, where we were like, oh my god, there are so many, like, not just people who are knowledgeable, people who are experts in each of these different fields, like really specialists. And that’s been what’s cool for us is like, we can go and find somebody who really knows their shit about Facebook ads, who really knows their shit about customer journeys, who really knows that they should about LinkedIn. And, they’ll just share all of their knowledge with us that they’ve taken years to game, and it just helps us not waste our time. That’s been some of the best things.

Marcos Bravo: That’s one of the things that really works or keeps me happy from growth meant that there’s nobody trying to pitch you a service or anything just like alright, well, professional to professional conversation anywhere.

Sophia Lazar: Yeah, people have been so nice. And you are one of those people I remember like early on, I think you’re one of our first.

Marcos Bravo: It was definitely a long time ago.

Sophia Lazar: I remember one thing like, always stuck out, you’re like you for a game. Your Instagram is not colorful enough and not fun enough. And I was like, You’re so right. Like, what are we doing? This is all about play. And like, I mean, there’s some there’s some serious element, which we’ll talk about soon, I’m sure. But it is a game and like that really stuck out. So yeah, thank you.

Marcos Bravo: And I had to say, I checked, I checked all of your social media before the call too and it’s a massive change. I mean, you guys are rocking your style. You have an incredible voice. And I’m using this as an intro to explain to people what cozy juicy real is because when I heard it, I was like, I don’t know why you guys are trying to sell. Is it an ice cream? Do you eat it? How does it work? So I’m gonna let you guys explain how Cozy Juicy Real came out as an idea and how it developed. So please, the stage is yours.

Sophia Lazar: With a funny name.

Jed Lazar: Yeah, for sure the name really throws people. We’ve never been like 100% about the name, but it’s the name. We’re going with it. Yeah, so basically, we were living in London in like 2016. And we were finding that we would like because we’re really social people. We’re coaches, we’re facilitators. And I don’t know if you have any friends who are coaches, but like coaches, that kind of people in my experience, who like to have like substantive, meaningful Hangouts, like we want our relationships to be meaningful, we want them to be interesting, want them to be juicy. So. So like we would meet up with friends, I don’t know if you’ve ever like lived in a major city. But like London, 9 million people, it’s huge. We’re cyclists, whether you’re cycling or taking the tube, if you want to visit a friend in London and hang out, it’s like a big commitment, it’s an hour to go see them and an hour to get back. it’s raining, like it’s a pain in the ass. So like you want that time to be really valuable. And what we were finding was that we met up with friends. And sometimes it was really great. And sometimes it was like a kind of catch-up. Like, I’ve been doing this, I’ve been watching this, you know, and it wasn’t it just wasn’t as meaningful. It wasn’t like going to the layers of our humanity that we all know were there. But sometimes we forget about or it is just the conversation doesn’t flow there naturally. And we’re like, look, we know there’s a better way to do this. Right? We know there’s a better way because we all have connecting conversations. We’re coaches. So we know we can get there. But we’re playful people. So we’re like, what if there were a game, right? You know what? It’s like a startup, you’re like, there’s some crazy idea. What if there was a game, right? Oh, maybe a board game that helps people have more interesting, meaningful connecting conversations. And so that’s all we had in the beginning. And like from there, it was like a multi-year process to develop, like what we have now, which is like, you know, a physical game. Yeah. Online games that we do for teams and team building all of that. But that’s like, took us a long time to get that.

Marcos Bravo: So in the beginning was just basically sort of a session, right? It was just you guys talking to people let’s get him involved in a game. Because it didn’t start as a board game. It was it was more of the idea of the game, right?

Sophia Lazar: Yeah, I mean, so what Jed touched on is kind of we’re both coaches, but we didn’t like being the people that were always facilitating conversations, like that was the awkward part. So like, in reality, the very first idea was actually to do an app. We were like, you know, let’s prototype the app. And what’s the easiest way to prototype that? Let’s make a physical version. So we actually just kind of created a physical version of the idea on paper and just wrote questions on pieces of paper, cards, and stuff. And it was a bit terrible at first. But people would play, they’d give us feedback, we’ve introduced something changed something, try something new. And then see where it went. And like, we just, like, throw out the bad ideas and keep the good ones. Eventually, it became a board game that is now kind of just like what we’ve been told about having a game to facilitate meaningful and fun conversations is that it take the pressure off everyone. Like no one is having to think of a question having to like, feel like they’re the ones asking those questions. It also balances the conversation because everyone has a ton. So there’s not just one person that dominates and talks the whole time.

Marcos Bravo: I remember the set of activities like that from HR and different companies and like alright, so who wants to start? No way nobody wants to start? Nobody wants to get involved. But I mean, even given the structure makes total sense because it’s weird to say it but it’s like gamifying a game so is that right? It’s not. We’re not pushing you out of your comfort zone. Do you just join the Fun, which is one of the things I love about it now, um, when we talk again a few years ago, this was around the time of the pandemic, wasn’t it? Did the pandemic sort of help you guys to either prototype more or to push the gaming to like, look, this is an essential part of keeping that human connection that Jed was saying, that didn’t help or did it work the other way around?

Sophia Lazar: Both

Jed Lazar: Yeah, at first were like, What the hell do we do, because at first we had a physical product. And then once we figured out how to put it online, then it was like it opened so many doors, because you remember, everybody was working online, no matter where they were in the world.

Sophia Lazar: So many people didn’t know how to connect. It was like, what do we do? How do we have those conversations that are like water cooler? Kind of conversations? So yeah, so in a way it was negative because we were kind of like ah…, we were planning to do a Kickstarter and make a board game. And now no one’s going out and doing anything, or meeting up. And then when we took it online, it kind of like, went on its own tangent of an online game. And team building was really popular community building, even for friends or family.

Marcos Bravo: Now, how did you guys take it? Because I mean, I have to say, and if you go, if you’re listening to this and go and check, the customers that the guys have is a very impressive list. They have you manage to push your brand into companies like Google or Nike or whatever. I mean, it’s a growth that doesn’t happen all the time. That’s sort of fast, I’m sure. I’m sure there’s a lot of hard work behind it. Absolutely. But your game is becoming part of a company’s initiatives to keep that humanity in their teams. But how did how was sort of your business development process get there?

Jed Lazar: Look, I don’t know if we’re lucky. I think that because we’ve done almost no marketing. Right? The only marketing we’ve ever done is, sometimes conferences will connect with a conference. And they need to network and get to know other conference attendees. Right? So sometimes we’ll offer something for conferences, people who go there to connect, get to know each other in a meaningful way. That’s it. Otherwise, and this is why I say maybe we’re lucky. Yeah, we, I’m always curious, like social media do you know, I know. I know. So I really it because it took us years to develop the product. And we really put a lot of love and a lot of intention, and we play-tested that game hundreds of times. And we’re still perfecting it. I think, because we put so much time into the product development part of this project, we have something now that really resonates. And so people talk about it’s different than anything else that I’ve seen out there. There are a lot of online events, and some of them are really high quality to like, and get to know people. But I think this combination of things is unique. And so because that people people talk. So oftentimes, I’ll get like people will schedule calls with me, you know, from a business. And they’ll say, you know, we’re thinking about doing a team building interview like they’re working for one of these companies and are talking about Google, Nike, etc. And, you know, I’ve got a bit of the impostor syndrome. So I was like, Oh, this is exciting. So I asked a question like, how did you find out about cozy juicy real, and they’re like, oh, like, some slack channel or some newsletter, and it’s nothing I’ve ever heard of. It’s just people. People have played it. And they it’s been out there for a few years, and people talk, and that’s how the road has gone.

Sophia Lazar: But the people move companies as the other thing that often happens is they’re like, Oh, I played it at blah, blah, blah. And now I’m working with Google, for example. And I want to do it. And so like, they’ve tried it before, and they want to bring it to the new place, which is also really common, I think.

Marcos Bravo: But that’s definitely the best way. I mean, that’s, that’s not, I mean, that is pure marketing, but it’s a good kind of marketing. So it’s not that you guys are spending tons and PPC and ads and stuff. And that’s something that I as a branding side of the story myself. I love the tone of voice that you guys develop. I mean, it’s sort of put the founders behind the brand and the brand took this personality and zone. And every time you guys talk even though you talk about your story, I feel that there is a personality to go to cozy juicy real that is clear. Now it is and it’s and it’s attractive, and it’s fun. So it’s like you want to hang out because it gives real.

Sophia Lazar: That’s nice to hear.

Marcos Bravo: And that’s in that sense, I think it’s absolutely a good job. And something I wanted to and I don’t want to attach it as a to change the subject of the whole podcast is but you guys had a couple and you literally breathed this 24 hours? I hope not 24 hours, probably a lot. How’s it to develop a not only a product company together?, Has it been like hard moments? Or how are you guys trying to balance this work life, especially as a couple?

Jed Lazar: You can see my like, Sofia smile. Sometimes you do this. Well, sometimes we suck it. Right. I think working with I think, you know, being in a relationship, I’ve got humility about it, we, you know, we’re married, we’ve been in a relationship for eight years been married for seven years. Before getting married, I always thought, I’m gonna be that to be that guy, like, who’s like in a relationship and everything’s always calm. And like, we don’t have fights like, like, I’m much more humble.

Marcos Bravo: Now you know.

Jed Lazar: If you want to be in a relationship, you’re going to be doing work, unless you’re like the Buddha. And if you want to be in a relationship and have a business with your partner, you’re gonna be doing a lot of negotiation. And that’s just going to be part of the territory, right?

Sophia Lazar: So to answer your question, not always easy. And I also think, Well, I think, we both think we make a really good team. Like I have strengths, and Jed has strains that work really well together. I think it’s actually been really fun to explore the relationship in that way also is like having a really kind of similar vision and values. So wanting to build something together, that kind of like, has the same kind of mission has been really awesome. And really fun. Like, I think, like I said, Really playful. So it’s also been really fun and creative.

Marcos Bravo: I mean, that’s really cool, because you guys are, I mean, your example, putting the couple part of the site is exactly how I guess, companies should find co-founders or the managing team. I mean, they need to have some sort of similar values, and they need to build the same direction. I mean, it’s amazing to happen to you guys as a couple, just a plus. Going into this growth of the company, right? Last, when we talked, it was just the two of you guys doing everything. And I remember you guys being super busy with every little detail. But now you’re up hiring people, right how many people do you have working on the team?

Sophia Lazar: So right now, two people, we did have three at some point, just to kind of help with other things. We also hire external people for copywriting. Or like, right now we have a web app developer, who’s building our crazy GC real app, which is super exciting. Well. So yeah, we still use kinds of freelancers for extra help. But that’s why we got two full-time people.

Marcos Bravo: How much bigger? Do you want to grow the team? I mean, how do you envision this? Obviously, everything started with a little project and then you need more people to cover certain things. And then suddenly will be coasted use real power I don’t want this No spoilers in here. I don’t know anything. So I’m it’s sort of asking to like what’s coming next, like, where are you guys going next with the idea? Because the product is great. And it looks amazing. How do you take this to the next level?

Jed Lazar: So rather than growing a bigger team, we’re going to be moving more in the direction of the SOS model. So we’ve been either us or our trained facilitators will host team building events. And so that requires a lot of human hours to do that. And we’re gonna keep doing that. And our facilitators will keep doing that, you know, ongoing. But like Sophia was saying, We’ve hired web developers. So we’re developing an app that will be able to host events for smaller teams, without needing a human facilitator. It won’t be like the full bells and whistles of a human-facilitated event. But it’s going to be able to be a great solution for smaller teams, especially teams with smaller budgets. Because having a human there is obviously going to increase the cost of the budget. So a lot of events are going to be run by they’re going to be able to have a sauce subscription. And that will mean that we don’t have to be facilitating as many events so I think that’s the next big evolution of the company. Rather than growing the team bigger is just being able to do the same or more but with the same resources.

Marcos Bravo: That is really cool.

Sophia Lazar: Often been asked by smaller teams, and it just doesn’t really make sense for them. Also the time, like having to schedule a time has been a bit challenging for some people. So having a self-facilitated version, I think it’s gonna be a really cool shift.

Marcos Bravo: I’d love I love the growth in that area. And I’m from again because marketing is my thing. What do you think is the key thing? So you mentioned the social media? I sort of agree, this word doesn’t work. I mean, what’s exactly the influence that it has in the sales or whatever? That’s always a big discussion. But what do you think is the best marketing move that you guys have done since inventing cozy juicy real? Something that you sit beside the luck because I think he’s more than luck. It’s probably a lot of hard work. But there must be something that is your favorite thing. Like, no, we need to double down on this.

Sophia Lazar: I think outreach to communities like being able to play for, like being able to facilitate events for large groups, whether it’s through conferences, we’ve also done meetup.com events, like just for free. And other community events like that, like today, we’re doing Wednesday, which I’m not sure if anyone’s heard that. There’s just a great community. And so being able to like, share it with communities like that, who gets a play, because it’s one of those games where you can’t really imagine it or see the value until you play. And when you play, you’re like, I want to do this with these people I want to do here, it’s like, that’s how it’s shared the most. And I think that’s the most kind of valuable outlet for us.

Marcos Bravo: I want to I wanted to ask you guys because we’ve been talking about the game a lot. And as you said, it’s not something you understand until you play it. So how would you pitch the idea or the solution behind cozy juicy real? It uses real attempts to show you guys a try or tested many ways. But what’s your favorite way to explain what cozy juicy real does as a result?

Jed Lazar: Yeah, this is one of the things that I incessantly feel like I need to be better at, like the pitch 60 seconds to sell the idea. But I think yeah, but I think Sofia can add to this, I think the real valuable thing about the game, especially for people who are on remote teams, is that deeper connection piece, right? It’s like you gotta start off. And with, okay, that’s my supervisor. That’s the guy who works in the marketing team. You know, that’s the woman who works in the sales team, whatever. At the end of an event, people are people, right, where humans are seeing eye to eye. Believe it or not people, even people who don’t think they want to go there, often, people want to go to a place of connection. And so if you give them an easy way to do that, like an easy excuse to do that. People just kind of let go in a really surprising way. And they share things about themselves that they’re surprised by because it’s easier than we realize when you’re in a safe space. And that’s one of the things the game does is is helps to create a safe space, where there’s affirmation, where we can choose to go as light or as deep as we want to go. There’s all these mechanics built in, right? So that people feel safe. And so by the end, you don’t just see that person as that person in that team, that person that it’s like, you’ve seen them as another human, there’s a shared humanity piece. After that, you can reach out to that person for anything business context, and you have this foundation of a relationship now. And I think that’s the biggest takeaway. I have a hard time explaining that when people want to talk about what is a cozy juicy real event, you know, what would it do for my company? I have a hard time explaining it, like Sophia said Until you play it. I do my best. And that’s my, like, three-minute elevator pitch.

Sophia Lazar: And I think I think doing a demo. Like that’s the other thing. So I’m wondering if you’re up for answering your question.

Marcos Bravo: No, no, absolutely. So that’s sort of the essence that I wanted to take from that from what you were supposed to answer which is exactly what I was expecting. But it just is that you’re solving a huge problem in teams when people see each other as positions as this is the manager. This is the intern whatever and eventually you end up being humans. This is John now this is Beth This is so you get to learn the names you get to learn their their likes. I mean it’s super unnecessary This is not nice to have. This is something that really builds the structure or the strength of teams in different companies and the fact that all of the big these big companies are choosing you guys is proof I’m just always trying to ask for some time towards the end of clever questions, but I always get lost in the story. So I wanted to go back and ask you what can you pinpoint that was your biggest mistake or something that set you back in this journey? Something that you feel like, Oh my God, why did we do that? And we missed so much time or money trying to do that and didn’t bring any result? Do you have something that is like, still there?

Sophia Lazar: I have two answers. I’m sure.

Jed Lazar: We’ve made a lot of mistakes. Yeah, you go first.

Sophia Lazar: Well, the two that have come to my mind. One is social media, I think investing a lot of time trying to do that, is right. And just buying in our heads over and over and over again. And then the other is not so much of doing something but not doing something I wish that we’d started the app earlier. Like building our own web app sooner. That would be the two that come to my mind, like very obvious. Yeah. Any others?

Jed Lazar: You’re talking about social media. We spent a lot of money we did. We recently did a Kickstarter so that we can raise the money to create the physical board. Yeah. Because that takes a fair chunk of change. To do. We wasted a lot of time on Facebook ads and reaching out to influencers and all these, a lot of projects that really never came to fruition. We found some things that came to fruition, but a lot of them were a waste of time. And we spent a chunk of change on Facebook ads, which really didn’t do much. They didn’t do anything. The Facebook ads helped us hone in on our copy and hone in on the images that resonate with people, but as like a way to actually spread the word and generate sales. Not for not for us anyway.

Marcos Bravo: I totally get it. I mean, for me, it’s still a mystery how sometimes we invest all this time and money and things that we can measure but again, in my opinion, the way you guys develop your tone of voice is on point is just as great. So for people who are curious about cozy juicy real for or for companies that are listening to this, and they’re like, alright, well, we need something to keep these people human because they’re not acting like humans. Now they’re acting like crazy workers. So how can they reach out to you and how can they either get the ball of the game or just get a proposition with you guys?

Jed Lazar: They go to our website, they can cozy juicy real if they can remember the name.

Marcos Bravo: I will add the link absolutely.

Jed Lazar: And then the best thing they can do is they can do like a 20-minute call, and where they or somebody on their team, whoever they want, can come and we can actually play a couple rounds of a game so that they can experience it and then they’ll get a sense for if it’s a good fit for what they’re looking for.

Sophia Lazar: Yeah, so we can give you an email as well. And that’s [email protected] Very easy.

Marcos Bravo: I will also add that one on the bottom there. What about the board game? Is it available for purchase? Are you still doing the Kickstarter? How’s it working with the physical version?

Sophia Lazar: Well the Kickstarter went right and we far exceeded our goal. So literally this week we press order on the the many games that we’re going to order and they should arrive in the fall. So around November is what we’re hoping for so nice treat Christmas but yeah, super excited. People can pre-order on the website now so the Kickstarter has finished but we’ve also got really good offers right now for bundles on our preorder website.

Marcos Bravo: I’ll make sure all of the links are right there and again, I want to thank you for being the last guest that I have in my studio here because the next one will be in a completely different place people be surprised I hope I’m gonna have to do it in the beach but anywhere it will end up being you guys already part of the history of this place. And all the podcasts as well. So one more time, guys, I want to thank you for coming. Anything else you want to say anything in any shout-out you want to have in the pockets?

Sophia Lazar: I want to ask you a question. Like a cozy juicy real question?

Marcos Bravo: Please go for it. Yes.

Sophia Lazar: Which one would you like to choose?

Jed Lazar: Cozy is like the easiest get-to-know-your questions. Do you see share a little more real share a little more?

Marcos Bravo: We’re gonna keep it balanced. We’re gonna go for Juicy because it’s cool.

Sophia Lazar: Oh, yeah. All right. We’re going for juicy.

Jed Lazar: Take a breath.

Marcos Bravo: Pressure has given me here.

Sophia Lazar: Over the last few months, what’s something meaningful that’s happened in your life that the other players, us might not know about? Something meaningful that’s happened in your life over the last few months.

Marcos Bravo: Well, you guys are already aware of this. We talked about it before the show. But yeah, I mean to let people know that I decided to change my location, leave my house with my family, not leave my family, and take my whole family with me on an adventure to live next to the beach and start a crazy business. That’s something that is scary, is killing me inside but also that I’m so excited about it. So that was the perfect question.

Sophia Lazar: Awesome. Love it.

Sophia Lazar: Oh, giving you a high five. All right. Yeah.

Marcos Bravo: All right. Thank you one more time to be in the show. Like I said before, I’m going to add all of your details into the description so people can reach out and learn more about cozy juicy real. Thanks. And all the best Congratulations and good luck in all your future endeavors with them.

Sophia Lazar: Good luck with the move. Yeah. Hopefully, see you in person.

Marcos Bravo: Absolutely. You’re welcome. Bye-bye.

Marcos Bravo: Okay, then that was our conversation. Again, these guys are amazing. I talked to them many years ago when they were just building this idea. And as you can see, now, it has become more than they do. So let me do our classic swoop, which was still a little melancholic, our last episode here, but let’s go straight to the swoop. Okay, things I’m taking with me from this episode, you always find a solution. Looking around you. Right? There’s not a big process behind finding the right solution for the right problem and creating a product that will solve that problem. The guys did it because it was based on their experience while there was something missing out there that they knew could help them to create. So finding inspiration in real-life problems is a huge thing. Another thing that I took with me is that marketing is a big problem or not a problem, but it’s a big thing that you really need to think about. Jed and Sophia, are still practicing and testing and doing new things with their marketing, At the same time that they improving and growing, they’re growing their company. So it’s very important for you to remember that marketing is not going to be an exact science, this is something you have to develop throughout your journey. And if I have to keep up another thing is their relationship too. Not always you’re going to create a company with your partner with your wife or girlfriend. But sometimes you will have to find the right co-founder and the fact of finding someone with the same set of values and ideas that complement yours. So it’s not just one sort of straight line. It’s a natural conversation of different points of view. That is what makes a company succeed. They did very, very well by combining their superpowers into something great. So those are the things that I’m taking from this conversation that I’m definitely applying into my own business life. So let me just close this swoop. I really want to thank you for the last eight episodes that we’ve done together. This is sort of for me a half season. Halfway. It is also the last episode. We’re recording here, as I mentioned before, and we will bring you more news about what’s going to happen where we’re going to be doing the new episodes and I’m preparing a very nice surprise for the next one’s upcoming. So once again, I want to thank you for watching, I want to thank you for your support. And I want to invite you to subscribe to follow our social media channels and to talk to us we love talking to you. My name is Marcos. This is passing the torch and I will see you next time cheers.